IMSLP Forums

The current page called Bethany http://imslp.org/wiki/Bethany_%28Rhys-H ... William%29 contains only an excerpt, and can be removed. I propose uploading the complete cantata in vocal score, to a new work page that accurately reflects the authorship of the libretto. The current one does not. I will then create a separate work page for "O Little Town of Bethlehem."

I'm not sure I understand. If Rhys-Herbert was the composer of Bethany, then the work should go on his work page, with the librettist identified in the librettist field. The work will come up on the librettist's page as well.

If O Little Town of Bethlehem is an excerpt from this cantata, then it needs to stay on this page under an "Excerpts" header. In the case of very famous excerpt, to avoid people not finding it, we can do a page for O Little Town that redirects to Bethany, but we only do this rarely. This particular example would seem appropriate, though.

It would not be appropriate to have a separate page for the excerpt and the full work, because over time, people will not realize there are two pages, and some will upload to one, and some to the other, so we won't have all editions on one page. There is also the possibility of duplicate editions that are avoided if there is only one location for the excerpt.

What do the other admins think?

Hard to find out much information on this, as Grove doesn't give Rhys-Herbert even a passing mention, and there's only an unattributed source on Wikipedia for the carol stating that "William Rhys-Herbert included a new hymn-tune and harmonization as part of his 1909 cantata, Bethany" .

The text for the carol was written by Philip Brooks, who appears as the sole librettist on our current IMSLP page for Bethany. Wikipedia also indicates that the librettist for the cantata was "William ApMadoc, a noted singer, adjudicator, publisher, temperance campaigner and conductor from Chicago, who provided Dr Rhys-Herbert with texts for many other settings in both Welsh and English".

If Wikipedia is correct on both counts (which isn't necessarily the case), then as Steltz rightly indicated we should retain the current page for the cantata Bethany, with O Little Town of Bethlehem as an extract, as it's listed now. The librettist field on that page needs altering to include William ApMadoc (d. 1916), but Brooks should continue to be mentioned as well, as his words were used in the 'O Little Town of Bethlehem' excerpt.

If davidevenathomas can refer us to additional, and verifiable, information concerning this cantata, it could help to improve the accuracy of the details given on the work page, which would also be enhanced if he were to upload the complete vocal score

Thanks for your guidance. I'll upload the cantata, leave "O Little" where it is, and amend the authorship of the libretto. If steltz would please make the redirect page and clarify the Excerpts header, I'd appreciate it.

I may be the only person researching this obscure composer, and have been developing the wiki page. dET

Thanks to all people who are researching obscure composers!

The solution ended up being slightly different, after all. It turns out we do have Lewis H. Redner's version, not the original, but an arrangement for brass by Michel Rondeau. I have put info boxes on each page with redirects.

http://imslp.org/wiki/Bethany_%28Mason,_Lowell%29

http://imslp.org/wiki/O_Little_Town_of_ ... ewis_H.%29

David, please check these out and see if it is clear.

It would be nice to have Redner's original, just so uploaded versions and arrangements could be compared so we could see which page they belong on.

[edit] I just have tried searching "O Little Town of Bethlehem" to see if both versions come up (in case a user doesn't know the composer). I see that we have other versions in carol collections. At some point (not today -- I have a long examining day), I will find the others and make links.